Nice talking to you in the moment – Thanks for the suggestion.

I was ready to post this when I noticed your comment.
I hope you will want to continue this conversation.
There is lots of stuff Jesus taught His Disciples that is “Ignored” today.
Those who still believe they can make a disciple today…

Should at least teach what Jesus taught His Disciples – Yes?

————–

Jesus also taught “His Disciples” NOT to be called Teacher. Hmmm?
Jesus taught – “ONE” is your Teacher… Mat 23:8. Hmmm? Jesus also taught…
Your Teacher is God, and the Father, and the Son, and the HOLY Spirit.

1 – NOT to be called teacher for you have “ONE” teacher, Christ. Mt 23:8
2 – NOT to be called leader for you have “ONE” leader, Christ, Mt 23:10
3 – ALL shall be taught of God. Jn 6:45
4 – ALL things, shall be taught you by the Holy Spirit, God. Jn 14:26
5 – ALL truth, will come as the Spirit of truth guides and leads. Jn 16:13
6 – Jesus, as man, does nothing of himself, and is taught of God. Jn 8:28
7 – Peter, knowing Jesus was the Christ, the Son of the living God,
received the revelation from Father God, and NOT from man. Mt 16:17
Jesus, as man, gave “All” the glory, all the credit to God the Father.

John the apostle, a “Disciple of Christ” taught what Jesus taught.

1 – ALL know, discern, all things. From the anointing in you. 1 Jn 2:20
2 – You need not any man teach you. Some will seduce you. 1 Jn 2:26-27
3 – ALL things, are taught to you by the anointing. 1 Jn 2:27

Paul the apostle, a “Disciple of Christ” taught what Jesus taught.

1- The gospel, NOT taught to me by man, but by revelation. Ga 1:11-12
2 – I conferred NOT with flesh and blood. Ga 1:16
3 – You have heard Jesus, and have been taught by Jesus. Eph 4:21
4 – You are taught by God to love one another. 1 Thes 4:9
5 – When together, all can teach, all can get revelation. 1 Cor 14:26
6 – Be led by the Spirit of God, and be a son of God. Rm 8:14

How many today, (who say they are “Making Disciples,”)
Teach what Jesus commanded His Disciples?
“ONE” is your Teacher, and you are all brothers. Mat 23:8 NASB.

Teach what His Disciples taught?
You need not any man teach you. Some will seduce you. 1 Jn 2:26-27

In my experience, most today “Ignore” or “Twist” what Jesus taught.

And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold:
them also I must bring, and they shall “hear My voice; “
and there shall be “ONE” fold, and “ONE” shepherd.
John 10:16

One Fold – One Shepherd – One Voice – One Leader – One Teacher

{{{{{{ Jesus }}}}}}

mark

A final thought…you may want to consider starting a blog! You’ve got a lot to say and are opinionated enough to generate discussion.

mark

Mark – Thanks for allowing the conversation.
For me it is much more then splitting hairs. It’s about “Traditions.”
Jesus warns us about “Traditions” that make Void God’s word. Mk 7:13
And what I was taught turned out to be “Traditions” NOT in the Bible.

Making Disciples is NOT mentioned in any of the epistles. Hmmm?
None of “His Disciples” talked about it. Or, taught how to do it.

C, G mentions Mat 28:19 “Go and make disciples” – But…
In my experience, many today, “Ignore” or “Twist” the next verse.

Mat 28:20 NKJV
**teaching them to “observe” all things that I have commanded you**

Seems Jesus, commanded His Disciples, NOT to be called “Leader.”
For “ONE” is your Leader, that is, Christ. Mat 28:20 NASB.

And – NOT one of His Disciples called them self – “Leader.”
NOT one of His Disciples called another “Disciple” – “Leader.”

Mat 23:10-12 NASB – New American Standard Bible
Do NOT be called leaders; for “ONE” is your Leader, that is, Christ.
But the greatest among you shall be your servant.
Whoever exalts himself shall be humbled;
and whoever humbles himself shall be exalted.

In the Bible, NOT one of His Disciples called them self – “Leader.”
ALL of “His Disciples” called themselves “Servants.”

Rom 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ,
Php 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ,
Col 4:12 Epaphras, who is one of you, a servant of Christ,
Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God,
Jas 1:1 James, a servant of God
2Pe 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant

How many today, (who say they are “Making Disciples,”)
Will Teach what Jesus commanded His Disciples?

“Do NOT be called leaders; for “ONE” is your Leader, that is, Christ?”
My Sheep – Hear My Voice – and – Follow Me. John 10:27.

Jesus never taught His Disciples to follow “mere fallible humans.”
Jesus always taught His Disciples to “Follow Him – Jesus.”
Mt 4:19, Mt 19:21, Mr 6:1, Mr 10:21, Lk 5:27, Lk 18:22, etc…

If someone calls them self “Leader?”
Allows others to call them “Leader?’

Are they one of “His Disciples?”

Why isn’t what Jesus taught “His Disciples” important?

mark

Are all who call themselves “Christians”(for example, on a survey) a disciple of Jesus? Absolutely not. We agree. Are many church attendees, who would call themselves a Christian, really in the same category as those who turned away when the teaching became “too difficult?” Absolutely. We agree.

Did Jesus’ disciples make disciples? Absolutely. In every case? No. Did they do it perfectly? No. Was Timothy a disciple? Yes. Did John make disciples in Ephesus? Yes. Did Peter make disciples? He was writing to people who knew him. On the idea that only Christ made disciples, I think you are splitting hairs.

I love conversation here and everyone is entitled to their opinion. I think you’ve stated yours very well. Although we differ, thanks for jumping in here.

mark

These few verses alone convicts me that…
I can NOT make a “Disciple of Jesus.”

When I thought I was “making disciples”
as I was taught by those who called themselves “Leaders,”
all I accomplished was making a
disciple of Amos and what Amos believed.

Never made a “Disciple of Christ.”
A learner, pupil, learning directly from Jesus.

Matthew 16:24-25
Then said Jesus unto **his disciples,**
If any man will come after me,
let him **deny himself,**
and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and
whosoever will *lose his life for my sake* shall find it.

Luke 14:33
So likewise, whosoever he be of you
*that forsaketh NOT ALL that he hath,**
he can NOT be my disciple.

These few verses alone convicts me that
I can NOT make a “Disciple of Christ.”

Never figured out…
How do you get someone to “Deny Themself?”
How do you get someone to “Lose their life for Jesus’ sake?”
How do you get someone to “Forsake All?”

How many today – Who call themselves “Disciples of Jesus?”
Can – “learn” from Jesus directly? NO middle man?

And – “Deny Them self?”
And – “Lose their Life for Jesus’ sake?”
And – “Forsake ALL?”

Forsake ALL…
Power – Profit – Prestige – Titles – Positions – Glory – Reputation?

Seems this – being one of “His Disciples” – will cost you. – A Lot.

Yup – IMO – Being a “Disciple of Jesus” is way more
then being a “Follower.”

Thanks for the response. You end your reply with…
“what matters is that we are making followers of Jesus.”

From what I see in the Bible there is a “big difference” between
“followers of Jesus” and a follower being one of “His Disciples.”

ALL His Disciples did “Follow Jesus” – But…
NOT ALL who “Followed Jesus” were “His Disciples.”

Disciple in the Strong’s is #3101 mathetes – A learner, pupil.
“His Disciples” 2,000 years ago learned directly from Jesus.
And – Jesus, is the same, Yesterday, and Today, and Forever.

How many today “learn” from Jesus directly? NO middle man?

Many can “follow” Jesus at a distance, and even walk on the same path,
but are they “learning” directly from Jesus? NO middle man?

Or are they ”learning about him” from a another “Mere Fallible Human?”
Or “learning” from others on the same path? Who learned from others?

Jesus always spoke to the multitudes “who followed” in parables. – BUT…
When Jesus was “alone” with His Disciples He explained the parable.

All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables;
and without a parable spake he not unto them.
Matthew 13:34

and when they were alone, he expounded all things to his disciples.
Mark 4:33

These multitudes were all in the same location following Jesus?
But only “His Disciples, His pupils, learned” what Jesus meant.

John 6:45
It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God.

Deuteronomy 4:36
Out of heaven he made thee to “hear His voice,”
that *He might instruct thee:*

Seems to be two different things.

1 – “Making “Followers of Jesus.”

2 – “Making “Learners, Pupils of Jesus” – Making “Disciples of Jesus.”

And – I find NO place in the scriptures where one of “His Disciples”

was able to “Make a Disciple of Jesus” and how they did it.